EUROstohos, Balance in the distribution of burdens within the family

Women have much to offer to businesses, and the business world needs their presence, emphasizes the MEP of PASOK, Ms. Anna Karamanou, in the interview she gave to EuroStohos as part of the research “The European Businesswoman.”

Ms. Karamanou, who has extensive experience on the issue of gender equality at the national and European levels, supports the balanced distribution of responsibilities within the family and mentions the Finnish Prime Minister who took parental leave to be close to his newborn child. She opposes the discriminatory treatment of women, which hides pitfalls that hinder their progress, and emphasizes the need to open all professions to women in Greece and to promote more women into decision-making positions.

• Ms. Karamanou, you have extensive experience not only in political issues but also in women’s and general social issues. Do you believe that society today needs the woman entrepreneur?

Yes. I believe that women have creativity, ideas, and impressive practical skills. Therefore, I think that the business world also needs the presence of women. Women have much to offer to businesses. Moreover, from the research conducted by the World Bank in Third World countries, meaning developing countries and not in European Union countries like Greece, women have shown remarkable abilities in organizing and managing businesses.

The World Bank also notes the particular consistency of women in repaying the loans they receive from this bank. Women, based on the data collected by the International Bank, are more reliable in fulfilling their obligations. This adds to the business profile of women. Therefore, I would say that businesses are a sector that particularly suits women.

• Today there is a single market with the free movement of people, services, capital, and goods. Do you believe that the Greek woman entrepreneur should indeed approach her counterparts in other European Union countries in order to give a European dimension to the enhancement of women’s presence in the business sector?

I think so. Moreover, today modern technologies assist in this direction. They help connect Greek women entrepreneurs with other European businesswomen. Additionally, there are specific programs promoted at the European Union level initiated by the European Commission to strengthen women’s entrepreneurship.

So, technology along with the political will that exists at the European level can help the Greek woman entrepreneur develop her activities and evolve in the business sector.

• Ms. Karamanou, there is a fundamental problem for working women: the combination of family life with professional life. What do you think needs to be done to resolve this issue?

Yes, this is indeed a very serious problem. Despite the significant changes that have taken place in recent years, outdated beliefs and stereotypes about the roles of both genders still persist. Even today, there are many who believe that a woman’s place is at home.

Social expectations are different for men and women. While it is considered perfectly natural for a man to build a career and achieve financial independence, the same is not considered natural for women. For women, it is viewed that family and home should take priority.

Personally, I say “yes” to family and children, but there must be support from the state so that both women and men can combine their professional obligations with their family responsibilities. In the private sphere, within the family, the presence of men is as essential as that of women. Modern studies and research have shown this, and it is already being applied by the Swedes.

There should, therefore, be substantial support so that professional life and career can be combined with private life, meaning raising children and family life. For this reason, modern support infrastructures are needed so that women do not continue to bear the greatest burden of child-rearing and household organization.

Men also need to change their mindset, to challenge the stereotype that says a man must be strong, must not cry, and all that comes with it, and to want to contribute to family life. Modern psychologists say that the presence of the father is as essential as that of the mother for the healthy emotional, intellectual, and physical development of children, and therefore, emphasis should also be placed on this, that is, on the presence of men in the family.

I am in favor of equal rights and responsibilities. I believe there should be a fair and equal distribution of all obligations and responsibilities in both public and private life.

INSURANCE

• Ms. Karamanou, you raise a timely and important issue, that of insurance. What is your position on insurance rights regarding women?

I am in favor of equalizing the insurance rights of women and men, because through my long-standing participation in the struggles for women’s rights, I have found that this so-called protective legislation essentially constitutes a “trap” for women and carries a significant part of the responsibility for the degraded position of women in the labor market. The fifteen-year periods, reduced hours, early retirement—these all undermine women’s rights.

I believe that modern women do not need protection. They need respect for their rights, where there should be equality with men. They also need support for families, including child benefits, in order to increase births.

I am therefore in favor of equalizing the insurance rights of men and women. Moreover, today the average lifespan of women in Greece is eighty years, and seventy-five for men. Women live five years longer than men. Therefore, there is no justification for a difference in retirement age. The age of sixty-five applies to all countries in the European Union for both men and women.

If there are inequalities and discrimination in the labor market, if there is an unequal distribution of burdens within the family, I believe this should be addressed differently, through the individual and collective struggles of women. Not through the insurance system.

• However, Ms. Karamanou, when a working woman has a child, she needs reduced working hours.

Yes, there should be. You are right. However, we need to fight more for parental leave as is done in Scandinavian countries. I continually refer to the Scandinavian countries because they are pioneers in these areas. They have the best social security system, they are leaders in gender equality issues, and parental benefits are provided. In recent years, many men, I believe in a percentage exceeding 50%, in Sweden have taken parental leave.

While in the 1980s only about 5% took parental leave, today the number of men taking parental leave has greatly increased, and they are close to their newborn children. We also had the case of the Finnish Prime Minister who took parental leave to be with the child his wife gave birth to. These changes are coming to Greece with some delay, but they are coming. Modern developments are reaching here as well.

In conclusion, I am in favor of fully equalizing the insurance and retirement rights of men and women, precisely because I believe this is in favor of women. Discriminatory treatment hides pitfalls. It has worked against their professional development, against their credibility in the labor market, against their financial independence, and the autonomy of women. It has been detrimental to women, resulting in a gender division in the labor market today. Essentially, there are two labor markets: one for men and one for women. The women’s labor market is, of course, considered secondary. Women are viewed as second-class workers.

In order for us women to be taken seriously, we must show that we can meet our professional obligations in the same way that men do, and perhaps even better.

• However, Ms. Karamanou, shouldn’t we also have tangible evidence of society’s understanding of women’s contributions with their children, and create the necessary infrastructure and environment that will facilitate the combination of family life with professional life?

Absolutely. However, the professional recognition of women must be achievable. Private life is a domain that equally belongs to men and women, and their contribution should be equal, but the state must also take responsibility. If we want to boost fertility in Greece and increase births, we need to provide family benefits, child benefits, and incentivize births through the insurance system.

EUROPEAN EQUALITY POLICY

• Ms. Karamanou, in recent years the European Union has developed a clear policy to strengthen the position of women in active life and promote equality. You, who participate in the parliamentary committee for women’s rights in the European Parliament and have been very active, can you tell us what the key community developments are in this direction?

There is, first of all, a five-year program that has been approved by the community, the Council, and the European Parliament, which emphasizes both the professional recognition of women and the increase of female employment, as well as women’s participation in political life. This means their involvement in democratic institutions and in shaping and making decisions.

The Union’s policy on the issue was evident from the Amsterdam Treaty. We had a very serious development in the Treaty. Equal pay for equal value work, meaning equal working relationships. Recently, emphasis has been placed on the equal and balanced, I would say, participation of women in the decision-making process, where there is a serious deficit. This deficit is particularly noticeable here in Greece.

Therefore, in Greece, priority must be given to strengthening the position of women in the labor market, opening all professions and all schools to women. Now we have a new bill from the Ministry of National Defense, where around 25,000 new recruits are to be hired. We want to create a professional army (as is done in many countries of the Union), and women are excluded. The existence of double the unemployment rate among women is largely due to these exclusions.

To summarize, therefore, regarding European policy on women, emphasis is placed on the workplace and political life, where women must participate in decisions and in the planning of the future. Additionally, emphasis is given to combating violence against women. I believe that if women are equated with men in various areas, violence will decrease, because violence is the result of the perception that many men have of women’s inferiority.

Therefore, combating violence against women is a priority, especially the violence that occurs within the family, where the most cases are reported. Finally, emphasis is placed on combating the sexual exploitation of women, which has reached explosive proportions in recent years following developments in Eastern Europe.

THE WORK IN THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT

• Ms. Karamanou, would you like to tell us about your work in recent years?

I was the rapporteur for the opinion of the Women’s Committee of the European Parliament for the Intergovernmental Conference.

• Are you referring to the last Intergovernmental Conference that prepared the Treaty of the European Union, which was agreed upon in Nice, France, last December?

Yes. These are the proposals made by the Parliamentary Women’s Committee that were submitted to be taken into account in the new treaty (European Constitution). We requested that the new Treaty include a specific article ensuring balanced participation of women and men in all institutions of the European Union. This would have been a significant reform. Our request was not accepted.

However, it is a success that an article has been included that provides for equality and equal treatment in all areas. So far, we know that the treaties limit the issue of equality to the workplace. Therefore, when the Treaty states “in all areas,” it also includes the political arena and the decision-making space.

In another report of mine, which concerns the balanced participation of women and men in decision-making centers, I evaluate the progress since 1996, when a recommendation was adopted by the Council urging member states to promote balanced participation of women in decision-making centers. It includes an assessment of the progress made and proposals.

• When was your report adopted by the Plenary of the European Parliament?

At the beginning of 2001. Now I am the rapporteur for the opinion on behalf of the Parliamentary Committee on Civil Liberties, Justice and Home Affairs, of which I am a regular member, to the Women’s Committee, which has drafted a report on Women and Fundamentalism. I had provided an opinion on this report.

ü Ms. Karamanou, when the research on the European Entrepreneur is completed, an International Conference on the same topic will be organized. Would you like to participate as well?

Of course, I would be happy to participate.

BIOGRAPHY

Anna Karamanou was born in 1947 in Pyrgos, Ilia. She holds a degree from the Faculty of Philosophy at the University of Athens and has postgraduate studies in the USA. She has been a member of the Central Committee of PASOK since 1977. From 1974 to 1991, she served as General Secretary of OME-OTE. She served as General Secretary for Equality and has been the Secretary of the Women’s Sector of PASOK since 1994. She is the Vice President of the Socialist International Women and a founding member and General Secretary of the Political Association of Women. She has been a Member of the European Parliament since 1997, a member of the Committee on Civil Liberties, Justice and Home Affairs, and the Committee on Women’s Rights. She is the Vice President of the PES Group and the second Vice President of the Delegation to the EU-Bulgaria Joint Committee.

PARLIAMENTARY COMMITTEE OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT FOR WOMEN’S RIGHTS AND EQUAL OPPORTUNITIES

This Committee was established in 1979 as a temporary investigative committee to examine the status of women in Europe. In 1984, this investigative Committee was transformed into a permanent committee of the European Parliament, which today has 40 members. It is responsible for promoting women’s rights within the Union, for the implementation and improvement of Directives related to gender equality. Specifically, the Committee examines issues related to women’s professional activities, their role in the family and society, as well as the promotion and integration of equal opportunities policies in all areas of community action.